Victoria: In the play As You Like It”, Shakespeare once wrote that all the world’s a stage, and all the men and women are merely players. So let me ask you a question. Have you ever felt like an actor in a production of your own life playing a role, afraid of even being seen as your true self acting like someone that you’re not, so everyone will actually think that you’re a rockstar?

Well, this is the topic of our conversation today. And in today’s show, we’ll be looking at how you can step into – I’m going to call it an authentic limelight – and actually be a rockstar to the beat of your own tune and how you can learn to become authentically unstoppable and do it without having to pretend to be someone that you really not. To tell us the secrets to becoming a rock star is my coach extraordinaire, Nancy. Welcome back, Nancy.

Nancy: Thank you so much for having me today.

Victoria: I just want it to continue on the introduction because you’ve got such an interesting background and you have worked for many years, coaching business people, executives, individuals, artists, creatives, in so many different areas of their life in their career. And I know that you’re an expert in helping people truly discover their – let’s call it –their life’s purpose, their journey to have extraordinary, meaningful lives.

I know this topic around helping people become an authentic rockstar is well and truly within your wheelhouse. So I’m looking forward to today’s conversation. So welcome!

Nancy: Thank you. Thank you. That’s a great introduction. Thank you.

Victoria: So tell me, how many clients come to you specifically and say, not necessarily in the literal sense, but help me feel like I’m a rockstar. Help me feel as though I am the best person I can possibly be out on the stage of life.

Nancy: Like I, that’s a good question. Because I work with so many people who are usually creatives and you mentioned artists, there’s an element to everyone that I work with who desire to be rockstars, but also want to be known for something. So it takes it another step further. And I understand it because I felt exactly the same way.

And you know, it came down to, how do we be fully self-expressed without this fear of people judging us? And how do I really know exactly what it is I really want to express to the world so that I get to be that rockstar? And so that it feels genuinely authentic to me? Because when you get into that alignment and into that zone and into momentum, you do become a rockstar. It just happens.

Victoria: We live in a world right now, and there is so much accessibility to social media. And just media in general, that sometimes you need to be able to slice through that, what I call, the white noise in order to truly find your own voice without being drawn into other people’s worlds or other people’s voices and other people’s opinions on what you think you should be or not be.

Nancy: Yeah.

Victoria: I think that’s half the battle sometimes to be able to somehow stop or pause and reflect around, who are you, like, who am I? And what is it that I really truly want to create for my life that I feel is my definition of a rockstar?

Nancy: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. And look, one of the first things that I will tell the client that I’m working with is: stay in your own lane. And we really define what that looks like, what that feels like, especially in smaller industries or in companies, if you really want to build something for yourself, we have to take all of that focus away from media, social media – other people, what they’re doing; and really put that energy back into what we want for ourselves and why and what really lights us up really, because when you’re really lit up, anything is possible.

Victoria: So when clients come to you and they want to really embrace their version of being an authentic rockstar, what are some of the challenges that you have found with your direct experience around particularly helping creatives and artists and entrepreneurs and even executives that are wanting to totally punch out of that corporate life and unleash their artistic self?

Nancy: Yeah.

Victoria: What are some of the challenges that they come to you with that they’re presenting on a behavioural level or a mindset level that other block?

Nancy: The challenges they usually presenting is, and it goes deeper, I guess, but the first thing that comes to mind is this idea of perfectionism. So they’ll create a visual or a vision for themselves and it’s not possible to create that overnight, we have to start somewhere. And so it’s really looking at where we’re being a perfectionist, which is a huge block… in an artist’s or anyone’s life, because perfectionism, you know, it’s an illusion really.

Victoria: So, if we could break this down a little and unpack this a little bit more, what are the symptoms you’re dealing with perfectionism?

Nancy: Yeah, all it would be, the symptoms would be very critical of self as a lot of self-sabotage going on. There’s a lot of resentment thinking we need to be somewhere else, which is completely taking us outside of where we are now. There would be a huge fear of being seen. So, you know, hiding behind a laptop or hiding behind social media and spending hours scrolling.

And then at the end of the day, that leads to a depressive state. It can be very, you know, dysfunctional for us because we’re just left feeling very, unmotivated and unclear and it’s a trap. It just keeps going. The cycle needs to be broken.

Victoria: Okay. So out of, cause we obviously talking about, quite specific about the definition and unpacking some of the blockers to becoming a rockstar and feeling as though you are a rock star and in control of your life, out of some of those symptoms that you’ve described, whether it’s being critical of self, holding onto resentment or fear of being truly seeing what would be the most common?

Nancy: Oh, probably fear of being seen.

Victoria: I would agree with you on that.

Nancy: A hundred percent. Yeah, it is it’s. And it’s unconscious until where we get to a point where we have to be the rockstar, because we can’t go on anymore. Like, it gets to a breaking point.

Victoria: I’ve found that obviously with it doesn’t matter really the goal that you’re going after the being seen can be a blocker for many outcomes and many goals that you’re working on.

Nancy: Yeah.

Victoria: And I’m curious with what you have, how we end up in that place, where we have this deep fear of being seen. What have been your experiences when you coach clients on some of the journeys that they’ve gone on themselves that have contributed towards this belief and this mindset?

Nancy: Oh.

Victoria: I know I’m opening up a big can…

Nancy: Great. It starts with a lot, look… it’s an interesting one. Obviously, everything stems from our childhood. So that’s an unconscious behavior, but if you put on top of that, this epidemic, pandemic of comparison disorder that happens through social media and it happens in workplaces. And, you know, if you haven’t got the desire or the outcome or the pay rise, or if it’s not happening for you, you will continue to potentially put yourself down.

And so then there are a lot of things that add up to then feeling "I will not be seen. For who I am." Because I might, and realistically, the feeling is as bad as "I might die, this is my survival". It’s so intense. And I work with some seriously talented people and I was the same, you know, it was a real transformation I had to work through, which is why now I get to teach it.

And so it’s a process. It’s really a process. And even just this morning I was thinking about this myself and when clients really start to make a shift is when they start to become very vulnerable, we actually go to the place and we have a look at it and we feel it and we can unpack it together.

Victoria: So our comparison disorder is a really interesting label, that obviously sums up a potential common blocker that stops us from really feeling as though we want to take control and be on our own stage. And I’ve often said to clients over the years, I don’t know many people that wake up each morning and say, "Gosh, I want to shrink today" instead of "I want to shine".

Like, no one consciously goes in and carries that decision into the day. It is helping people understand, firstly, what your own definition is around why you compare, the gain of which you get, or not get, when you do go into comparison mode. And ultimately if we end up creating lives that are based off other people’s opinions or values or public personas, then you will wake out one day, maybe many years later and turn around and say, gosh, where did my life go?

Nancy: Yeah.

Victoria: And we all have an extraordinary opportunity to give ourselves the best musical possible on our own stage of life. And, okay. This is definitely my own personal philosophy that even not now, when?

Nancy: Yeah. the other piece I’ll add in as well is… another major challenge, is rejection. Because of the fear of rejection and what happens to us out of that space, which can go on for months, if we don’t know how to handle it, or if we haven’t created a ritual or something that helps us bounce back, then that can really scare us.

And so we just don’t do the thing. And so one of the things that I work very closely with clients on is rejection, in terms of actually what it means and coming out of it.

Victoria: That’s really interesting. So if we were to unpack some solutions, if you have identified with your client and set, there is a thought process, a belief structure around deep real fear, I mean, again, even with fear, I have a saying that fear actually stands for "Forgetting Everything is All Right".

Nancy: Forgetting…

Victoria: Take a moment. That’s what fear actually stands for.

Nancy: That’s true. I understand now.

Victoria: And sometimes most of the time actually not in fight or flight. The fear isn’t real. It’s what I call a false truth. And in that moment, we have the ability to be able to stop and pause and reflect and then ask ourselves, okay, are we really being chased down by that 300 pound grizzly bear? Probably not. So let’s keep it in perspective on really what is true and what is false.

Nancy: I think one of the things that I love as a solution to something like this, which is where meditation comes in, is the power of fear in the body. Because when you get into a situation where fear is present, it doesn’t matter what it is… and it can be public speaking or anything like that. There’s a solution where you can actually take some time out and really find it in your body and dissolve it, which I’ve also have had to do for all sorts of things.

Victoria: I’m going to totally put you on the spot here, could you take us through a mini example of your process, that when you are experiencing that threat or fear, and it’s very real in the moment, I’d love to experience your process around that.

Nancy: Ooh. Okay. Okay. I’m just trying to think of a scenario.

Victoria: Let’s go to something really simple, such as you need to give a presentation at work.

Nancy: Okay.

Victoria: And there’s 200 people on a zoom call and 200 sets of eyeballs bearing down on you.

Nancy: Yes. Oh, it’s so scary. I totally, and I did this in January, so I’ve been here. So the first thing I would suggest, or my process for myself and a client, would always be to have done that presentation all morning around the house. In my heels, whatever it takes, get into the vibe of the presentation way before the presentation.

And this is something that even talking with artists who tour, we get them into the energy of what that tour is going to feel like before they go – six months to a year before they tour – they’re into the same sleep schedule that they’re going to be touring on, because you’re doing 90 different countries in… right. So you actually have to be in the tour energy before it happens.

It’s very similar to this. That’s a big fear. So I get into the energy of the thing. If I know what the fear is going, if it’s coming. And I know the second thing I would do is I would definitely do some breathing exercises. And what I mean by that is just sitting down. And getting really present, putting a hand on my heart, hand on my belly and really just breathing into ‘everything’s okay‘. That kind of energy. Because when we’re delivering a presentation, we automatically go into our head. What am I going to say wrong? How’s this going to land? Everyone thinks I’m an idiot! Whatever we think to ourselves.

And it immediately takes us out of our power. And so in order to stay in our power in that presentation, we have to be in alignment with our energy. So it’s delivered really well and makes impact. So breathing is a huge part of that.

Victoria: I was doing another podcast recently with Coach Jude, and he was sharing that in each day we do 23,000 breaths. How powerful would it be? Well, we know the power of mindfulness, but in that moment, when you’re talking about breathing exercises, if we could just do a handful of those 23,000 breaths, how it would actually calm us down to be so present, to connect in with, really, the source of what’s going on.

Nancy: Yeah.

Victoria: And be mindful. I mean, a lot of the time our fears are carried, whether they’re false fears are real fear, but they carried the carried from our past. And 99% of the time. They’re going to be carried into tomorrow.

Nancy: Yeah.

Victoria: Until you stop and interrupt that behaviour.

Nancy: That’s right. And I think that’s why when we’re looking at it, like, how to be a rockstar delivering a presentation, it’s not about the words that you’re saying so much. Yes, the presentation, the PowerPoint, it’s all vital depending on the presentation, but it’s energy. It’s that genuine, authentic connection that you’re going to have with the audience that makes them wild.

I need more of that person. Bring that person back. It’s that connection. And if you have that connection with yourself first, and you know that you’re going to deliver something powerful in your heart and you learn how to do that. You can’t not be a rockstar because you’re bringing your authentic self to the table.

Victoria: So, what are some of your solutions and strategies that have had direct impact with helping clients start the journey of connecting with the really authentic version of who they are and who they want to be?

Nancy: Yeah, look really, it starts with identifying what are the real fears that are going on? Like, let’s just bring them to the table. Let’s talk about it. what are the thoughts that you’re having? Because they’ve usually subconscious, but when we actually make an effort to think, okay, this is actually what I am thinking, or this is what I’m feeling, ‘I’m really scared that X’, then we can at least identify it and we can discover where it’s come from.

If we want to, we can take all these other avenues. But from that space, we can almost recreate a new, powerful belief. We can let go of something and recreate something. And usually what I’ll do with a client is we’ll really have a look at inspired action, because action builds confidence.

What’s the thing that you’re putting off, what is it? What are we so afraid of? And when we start to cultivate courage is a very powerful thing that I do, as well, because it’s changed my life. I know how powerful courage is?

Victoria: What are some of the steps that you give your clients when you’re coaching them? What are the – I’ll ask a different way – what are the ingredients that we need to in your experience from where you coach from creating and cultivating courage?

Nancy: Okay. Firstly, you want to… the number one thing, every single person feels the same way. We’ve all feel like we’re alone in this. Like, every person I speak to would love more courage, whether It’s to identify more things about ourself, have better conversations with people, be authentic, whatever it is. So it’s identifying first, that if everyone is feeling this way, it’s actually okay, to some realm.

So the first step is that it always comes down to acceptance as well. Let’s not squash ourselves for who we’re being, because that just makes it so much worse. So it’s definitely, it’s a getting into the now moment of who we are. And then it’s let’s have a look at how we can change this tangibly.

What are the things are going to bring us more confidence, more authenticity? What do I feel like when I’m really living? What am I doing? Who am I being? It’s very much a series of questions to ask ourself. and I always say, you could do one thing today that you’ve been putting off for five years… is usually the time I find it’s a five-year cycle.

I’ll have women who are desperate to run their own business, but just haven’t had the courage. And I’m like, what? What’s the one thing you could do today? It could be to get more. It could be two what’s the business name, let’s go register it. What are the things? And we’ll write a tangible list. and one of the common things I’ll get is I don’t want to disrupt anyone or anything.

Victoria: It’s very interesting. With a recent podcast that I was having with one of our other coaches, and we were talking about secondary gain. I reframed it probably to secondary fear. Once you have identified what that outcome is, then what’s the potential threat if you move towards that? and what may you lose or the perception or the fear that you may lose?

So disruption to the family, disruption to your partner, disruption to the children, disruption, disruption, whatever you think you’ve got going on that you’re changing the goalposts. Now that you’ve actually made a decision to value you enough to say, I want to do this! This puts song in my heart, to change and break out of the Groundhog Day, sometimes, that we can often find ourselves in and we become a little bit complacent.

We become a little bit lazy. We become victims to our lives in many respect until, unfortunately, something happens that shakes us and wakes us up to say, no, I’m saying no to how I’m currently living my world. I need to create something that gives me much more of a life force and passion and a reason for existing.

Nancy: Yes,

Victoria: That calling gets so great, you cannot ignore it.

Nancy: It’s very present.

Victoria: So it’s also being able to support the client on that journey of, well, this is an amazing goal. We’ve got your outcomes here of what it looks like for you to be this incredible rock star in the stage of your own life. And therefore, let’s also now start to unpack your fears around once you achieve this, what could then be next level blockers?

And you literally start to annihilate them all along the way, and it opens up the runway to take off.

Nancy: Yeah, that’s super interesting. I love that.

Victoria: So it can be a simple process and just sometimes having the conversation brings the awareness to, then, other modalities and other triggers and other blockers that lie underneath. And that’s the incredible journey that we have at our disposal that we’re in control of the acceleration rate in terms of how quickly we want to actually achieve something in our life.

Nancy: Yes.

Victoria: So how important is it from the clients that you coach around this theme of a daily ritual?

Nancy: It’s very important. So I encourage everyone who I work with to, like to write, what is your, where do you feel like you can be self-expressed? For me, journaling is very powerful and to really ask yourself questions that then set you up for anything that might happen in that day or in the week where you’re really tapping into, okay, I’m going to do this. I’m also probably going to experience a lot of fear. How am I going to handle that? Who do I need to be when this fear takes over me? And actually write it out. The other thing that I find really powerful is too have tangible outcomes for the day, but don’t get set on that, that has to be the thing.

So, when you’re going to go out and be a rockstar, the idea behind this is you want to just feel lit up and go and do things that really excite you. And life doesn’t just, look at your to-do list and it all works out exactly that way. So there’s always going to be that disappointment or someone may not get back to you, which happens all the time, or, but it’s not making anything mean anything. It’s like letting go a little bit of how it turns out.

Victoria: That’s such a great point that you raised sometimes. And often a lot of the time we set a goal and we set an outcome, but the beauty is actually in the magic that happens along the way, and creating the space for a little bit of fluidity rather than constriction, because sometimes we can have these incredibly laid out planned goals and outcomes and what it looks like and feels like. And often I say this after gosh, 30-odd years in this space , plus, that it ultimately sometimes doesn’t even end up what you put down on a piece of paper, but it’s better. It just has this magic layer to it that it’s like, in another analogy if you’ve got this, we can use this as a comparison. We’ve got an outcome or a goal that we’re working on.

It’s like having a new baby, you don’t know the personality, you don’t know what ultimately they’re going to look like or sound like or behave and a goal or an outcome does have, I absolutely do believe, has its own life force, its own energetic imprint of how it’s going to unfold and grow up along the journey of letting it manifest.

Nancy: Yeah.

Victoria: However, the most important thing is to start with something on a piece of paper and give it space and flexibility to let it grow.

Nancy: Yeah, to let it grow, let it breathe. And just, I always say, just keep believing in the fact that you deserve this as much as anybody else deserves their goal. A lot of the time I find, I wouldn’t have even started my most profound goals or projects if I hadn’t had someone come along and believe in me first; like we have to feel worthy of it.

Victoria: And sometimes another saying that I’ve had with clients over these, I’ll let them borrow my wings of courage until their own wings develop.

Nancy: That’s right.

Victoria: And as they build their own wings of courage and resilience they start to fly independently after feeling what it feels like to fly, but you don’t know what it feels like to fly until, and I say this as an analogy, until you’re actually off the runway.

So sometimes, borrow other people’s words of encouragement whilst you’re building your own resources around you to have your own internal compass loud and strong where you become your own champion as well.

Nancy: Yeah. I love that and, like I was thinking about this before, however you talk to your best friend, like when you’re a kid about your dreams… that should never change. When I say should – keep doing that; talk about your dreams. Like, talk to people who you think may even offer you some support and tell them, because I guarantee you’ll get something.

Either think it’s brilliant or they’ll want to support you. And that just that initial encouragement can honestly, you’ll take off. You can take off it’s going to be open.

Victoria: Having created a stage for you, as a rockstar, in whatever that looks like for you in your world or your pursuits, both personally and professionally, the most important thing, regardless of the outcome is that you just put one foot in front of the other and you take a first step.

Nancy: Yeah.

Victoria: The rest will actually take care of itself.

Nancy: Yes. Love it.

Victoria: Love that conversation today. Thank you, Nancy, for joining us. Hopefully, there’s some tips and tools in there for those who are listening. And if you would like to find Nancy, you can just need to pop over to hello-coach.com and you’ll find Nancy. If you have… feel this calling to become a rockstar in your world.

So thank you very much for joining us today, Nancy.

Nancy: Thank you so much. I loved it.